Handset compatibility with UCM?

[darren.g]

Hi.

Not much experience with UCM or VoIP here, so pardon me if I make any glaring faux pas statements.

My place of work currently uses a PABX sub-leased from another tennant on the floor, however this "marriage" is soon to be going through a divorce, so we're going to need to implement our own phone system.

The boss wants to use UCS, however the powers-that-be are baulking at the price of the Cisco phones.

What I want to know is if there are other phones/handsets from other manufacturers (HP's 350x series are being looke at, for example) which are compatible with a UCS installation, or other Cisco based phone solution?

I know we need actual "phone" lines (ISDN T1 PRI is already on the need list), so that side doesn't worry me. What I need is to implement the core phone switching and voicemail - just preferably (from my boss's point of view) not with the expensive Cisco handsets.

Any input aprpeciated.

Thanks.

[Aaron Harrison]

Hi Darren

The flip side to that argument is why would you want to spend large amounts of money on an enterprise phone system, and then attach cheap handsets to it? By choosing cheap handsets, you will:

- lose any advanced/interesting functionality beyond basic dialling and answering

- incur large amounts of administrative overhead due to the extra work involved in configuring third party handsets

- lose any guarantee of compatibility of those handsets to the system, and any support from TAC when you have issues

- have to seperately manage the handset firmware

Also since it seems you are new, you are picking by far the hardest way to learn the system, not to mention putting your business through the pain you have while you learn that you have made a huge mistake right at the start of the project :-)

Aaron

[darren.g]

Aaron.

Good points, all - and ones I have made to my boss, and the powers-that-be.

However, in the end, almost everything comes down to the almighty dollar in this place, and if it can be done cheaper - regardless of the potential future pain - then we do it the cheap way (don't get me started on examples - trust me!).

I'm interested, however, in your comments about picking the hardest way to learn the system - are you trying to say there's an easier solution than UCM, or that the pain of integrating third-party handsets adds steeply to the learning curve when starting out with UCM management?

If the latter, it's one of the crosses I have to bear - luckily for me, I learn quickly (never touched a UCS before this job either, had to learn damn fast how they worked!), but yes, I realise I'll have a *lot* to learn in a short time to implement this. If the former, then I'm interested in knowing what you think would be an easier solutuion than UCM to implement. I can give more details regarding scope, size etc if necessary - I'm not wedded to one solution at this time - if there are better options, then I'm all for hearing them.

Cheers.

[Ayodeji Okanlawon]

To add to the excellent points raiase by Aaron. There is no logic on earth, in heaven on any other place in between that makes any iota of sense to spend so much money on a UCS solution and deploy 3rd party phones.

This is beyond a learning curve matter. Infact the learning to begin with is this is not the way to go.

Points to note

1. Integration issues

2. Support issues

3. Licensing issues ( Not sure how licensing with work with 3rd party phones)

4. Quality issues

5. It just doesnt tally up

I am certain that AAron is not suggesting you using any other solution apart from CUCM platform based. Apart from been a huge cisco fanatic (with good reasons) cisco telephony solution is by far the best.

On another note, when bosses are concerened that cost is an issue, its your honourable job to advise on solutions that will both fit the budget and will also be fit for purpose. I.e UCS and 3rd party phones are not a marriage to be considered! Dont be even suggest both going out on a date

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[darren.g]

aokanlawon wrote:
On another note, when bosses are concerened that cost is an issue, its your honourable job to advise on solutions that will both fit the budget and will also be fit for purpose. I.e UCS and 3rd party phones are not a marriage to be considered! Dont be even suggest both going out on a date 

What makes you think I haven't already done so? :-)

You both raise excellent points (especially the licensing one - I didn't even consider that) which I 1005 agree with - don't misunderstand me, I have recommended we buy the Cisco handsets if they don't want to bite the bullet and put in a full-blown IP PABX of their own (Ha! Not likely!) in the strongest possible terms. I've been bluntly told to investigate alternatives.

All I can do is say that while it appears using non-Cisco handsets *IS* possible, it's extremely likely to be beyond my immediate ability to make work, so in saving money on the non-Cisco handsets, they're going to blow it finding a consultant to get it working and maintain the system.

Thanks for your input, both of you.

Cheers.

[Aaron Harrison]

The pain will be everywhere. Every time someone wants a feature configuring, and you find it doesn't work, and there's nothing you can do about it and no one you can complain to.

Best thing you can do is buy a few Cisco handsets, and a few Walmart handsets, and then build yourself a small lab and see what features you get.

If it really does come down to money you're probably better off learning Asterisk.

Aaron

[Chris Deren · Accepted solution]

I agree with my colleagues here, however here is the list of Cisco approved 3rd party SIP phones for you to check out:

http://www.tekvizionlabs.com/3rdpartyprograms/sip_verification/verified_products.php

and list of supported features:

http://www.tekvizionlabs.com/3rdpartyprograms/sip_verification/feature_list.php

Just out of curiosity which Cisco phone models were you looking at? The 69XX and 39XX are pretty cheap, especially if you are looking to purchase the system from Cisco GOLD partner at significant discount.

HTH,

Chris

[darren.g]

Chris Deren wrote:
I agree with my colleagues here, however here is the list of Cisco approved 3rd party SIP phones for you to check out:
http://www.tekvizionlabs.com/3rdpartyprograms/sip_verification/verified_products.php
and list of supported features:
http://www.tekvizionlabs.com/3rdpartyprograms/sip_verification/feature_list.php
Just out of curiosity which Cisco phone models were you looking at? The 69XX and 39XX are pretty cheap, especially if you are looking to purchase the system from Cisco GOLD partner at significant discount.
HTH,
Chris

Now that's the kind of list I was looking for! Thanks, Chris!

As far as Cisco phones go - I believe that they were looking at the 79xx, depending on position/requirements - can't have the CEO having anything except the latest and greatest, you know. :-)

Appreciate your input - at least I can go back and say "Yes, these will work. but we should still buy the Csico phones because your preferred HP ones aren't approved".

Cheers.

[James Hawkins]

It would be useful if you could share the size of implementation you are considering.

UCS is a great solution but is really suited to larger deployments. Cisco have a whole range of option from the UC300/UC500 through CUCM Express and CUCM Business Edition (3 options here) before you get to full blown CUCM.

If you have 450 phones or less then CUCM Express might be ideal for you. Being router based it is cheaper than a UCS based solution which could free up budget for posher phones.

BTW the latest/greatest Cisco phones are the 8900/9900 series rather than the 7900 which is effectively a 10+ year old basic design.

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10451/index.html

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10453/index.html

[darren.g]

James Hawkins wrote:
It would be useful if you could share the size of implementation you are considering.
UCS is a great solution but is really suited to larger deployments. Cisco have a whole range of option from the UC300/UC500 through CUCM Express and CUCM Business Edition (3 options here) before you get to full blown CUCM.
If you have 450 phones or less then CUCM Express might be ideal for you. Being router based it is cheaper than a UCS based solution which could free up budget for posher phones.
BTW the latest/greatest Cisco phones are the 8900/9900 series rather than the 7900 which is effectively a 10+ year old basic design.
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10451/index.html
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10453/index.html

James.

I actually did a bit more research and came to that conclusion myself - and have not so gently nudged management in the direction of a UC560 with some additional licenses, which should be perfectly adequate (we're not looking at more than 100 phones and 1 x T1 ISDN service for outgong lines - the 560 gives me the option to add another T1 if necessary, which should be masses for what we need. All I need to do is assure myself it does voicemail well enough to meet the requirements, and I should be laughing.

I'd rather not give my boss more ways to hassle me via video on the phone - the bloody LYNC conferences are bad enough! :-) The 7900's look sexy enough to keep them happy and maybe save enough that I don't have to revisit my original query - how to make non-Cisco handsets work with Cisco kit!

Cheers